alternative to southdown sand

[canuckreef]

i found this site on another message board..and was wondering what some of you thought about it.. i have not really checked it out..but it may be an alternative to the southdown sand... looks like if enough of us get together we can order some and save a few $$..but i wonder on cost of shipping and also getting it over the magic line between the USA and canada...

well have a look and see what you think.. i dont need any sand myself..but there are lots of guys out there who do..so i pass this along to all.. in search of sand..

here is the site...

www.purearagonite.com

they are in new jersey or something like that..

[canadawest]

I have only read good things about this product. Apparently it is comparible to Caribea products, but much cheaper. The company produces it specifically for the aquarium trade so it is free of harmful materials.

There is a guy in WA state that organizes group buys for local reefers in the Pacific Northwest and then buys it by the pallet from the manufacturer. He sells it for $17.00US per 40lb bag and claims that is his cost to get it after shipping. Several local (Vancouver) reefers are heading down to their club meeting next month and are going to be bringing some back I believe.

Myself, I didn't want to wait until next month to setup my new refugium, so I am using dolomite from Home Depot. Cost less than $4 for a 20kg bag (44lb), is pure white and a nice fine grain size. Was enough for my new 10gal refugium, plus some left over to put on top of my existing aragonite in my main tank.

There is a big discussion on the topic of using dolomite for a DSB on Canreef's message board. Check it out if you like.

**Post edited to correct price. Correct price is $17US per bag, not $7US per bag (Pallet rate)**

[DJ88]

I seem to remember that it was $17 US a bag.

[Dman]

From what I've been able to glean for Dr. Ron Shimeks' posts is that you can use pretty much about any type of sand you like, including Silica. He is of the opinion, along with myself that the buffering capacity of Aragonite sand is over rated. Look at the chemistry involved. In order to disolve Aragonite like one would in a calcium reactor you need to lower the pH to levels that would be down right dangerous to your live stock, so basically if you have these depressed levels of pH in your tank, you have a more serious problem than what type of sand to use. Silica is also fine as it is made of the same material as our little glass boxes. Again the role of silica sand contributing to diatom blooms is again over rated due once again to the chemistry involved.
The only thing that really matters when setting up a DSB that is going to house the requisite critters and bacteria then the only thing that matters is size, and in this world, smaller is better :>
HTH

[Greg Moore]

Dman

I guess that's why hobbiests have more Dr's to choose from then grains of sand on a beach!

Aragonite begins to break down closer to 8.0/7.8 and aragonite products like ARM only require 7.5 to work _fully_. Therefore buffering advantages are more real then not, especially to newer hobbiest that often err and allow drops below 8.0. Also, aragonite has infinatly more porosity then silica sand allowing for more bacterial grow. Next, most aragonite sands are more rounded then most silicates and if they are not, they become so quicker the silicate being much softer, this is important to many critters, especially sifters.

Next, from personal experience, the silica/diatom issue is not always over rated. I experienced a brutal and endless bloom a couple of years ago after adding a SeaStorm filter. I didn't associate it with the problem until I had done some reading. The diatoms were controlable and eventually died off once the seastorm was removed. The model I had uses silica sand.

Smaller is better, while that blanket statement is true as far as most life in the sand is concerned (again, aragonites porosity allows bigger sizes with same results as non-porous silica), many tanks cannot use 'smaller is better'.. You need to be cautious wording like that when the board is read by first time hobbiests that can take advice as gospel.

Imagine the grief of a new hobbiest, just built a 135, planned on SPS (I know, not a newbie coral) and just bought the biggest best pumps available, only to turn things on and find their super fine sand blowing all over the place. Or the guy that sees half his wall cave down because the damsels tunneled all the fine sand to the front of the tank in a mater of minutes..

Many options, many reasons for them and there simply is no one solution suitable to all as your post might imply.. While aragonite is certainly more expensive, it is still unquestionably the safest choice. It still kills me how many newbies, on advice, spend $1k on a skimmer, $1.5K on lighting, both of which can (and probably will) be sold for a different model some day, yet try to save a few bucks on the substrate, easily near the top of the list for importance, and at $40 a bag, still only a couple of hundred for a decent sized tank. Ever tried to disconnect a bad choice in light bulb? Not too tough... Ever tried to pull out every last grain of sand in an established tank to change it over?? Impossible without a tear down.. Some things should not be left to chance on a new build..

Greg Moore

[reefburnaby]

Hi,

You may want to check some local supplilers of sand and gravel. It is possible to get pure calcium carbonate (which is what southdown is basically). I can get it here in Vancouver, but I couldn't get it in the right grade (grain size was way too small). It was about $5 for 40 or 50lb bag (or so...can't remember).

Anyway, check your sand suppliers and you might get lucky :)

- Victor.